That sounds as good a theory as any of the others I've read here Wolfie.

It makes me sad to think of this life ending, as I like being who I am now. Me, with my children and my life, my home and my job. It all suits me and I hope it continues that way for a long long time yet.
And when it's all over, I'll be as sad as anyone ever is to say goodbye to it all, and I know that however long I live I am not going to be ready to let go of my life and move away from my children and all my loved ones.
That couldn't change, because whether you are Kin or Non-Kin you still have to say goodbye to the ones you love and move on without them, and that always hurts.

As for what happens, well, I believe I will be re-incarnated as I am Kin.
Your theory for Non-Kin Kes, is interesting. I have never thought about it like that. In fact I haven't really thought about it very much at all, apart from thinking that all the energy has to go somewhere as energy cannot be destroyed, and what a waste it would be if it wasn't re-used in some way.

But I do believe in the Vibrational Theory of Kin. So if your essence vibrates at the right level for re-incarnation, then you will, and if it doesn't, you won't. It's kind of like blue eyes or brown hair, it doesn't mean you're better or worse, it is just something that is built into what makes you you.

I am another believer in Vibrational Theory of essences.
It just makes more sense to me than any other way of looking at things. Everything vibrates on some level, and which level that is determines it's abilities, appearance and feel, that has been proven, our essences are no different. Whether we are on one of our Earth walks or not our essences have a unique vibrational level, that remains the same throughout our existence.
I am happy to accept Kes's theory for what happens to Non-Kin after death, only because it is the only one presented here by a human being. I know that there are many other theories, including the one that says when you are dead you are dead and that is that. This is the only one I can catagorically say I do not believe, and never could, as Non-Kin souls are also made of energy, and as Moon says, energy cannot be destroyed and so must go somewhere. It cannot just evaporate and dissapear.
So for me the 'dead is dead' theory just does not work.

So you don't accept my theory because it makes sense or because it has merit, but because I am human?
That has a certain kind of twisted logic I suppose.

The "dead is dead" theory doesn't work for me either. However, I don't really understand why a human's theory on otherkin souls has no merit solely because they are human so then would an otherkin's theory on human souls have no merit? That just doesn't make sense to me. It's like saying you can't have theories on biology unless you're a biologist or that you can't have theories on Christianity if you aren't a Christian...

I don't believe anyone said that any theory had no merit, and I wasn't meaning to be rude to you Kes.
I merely meant and I still believe, that if you needed advice on say brain surgery and you had a choice of two people to ask, would you ask the brain surgeon what he thought or would you consult a plumber?
I believe that the person who would have the best idea of what happens to anyone at any given time would be a member of that race. They would have the inside track so to speak.
Sorry if my previous comment sounded insulting Kes. It truly wasn't meant to.

Just because you're a certain species doesn't mean you automatically know where that species soul will be going especially since we currently *aren't* technically members of that species. I mean if it turns out we're all nuts then we all had some fabulous theories that may or may not have any truth, merit, etc. to them.

Well I think that since a lot of the members here don't associate with what I think Katie called their 'overcoat' but with the essence inside, and since technically your essence is always your species, then a lot of the members here are always their species.

I am curious too as to why whenever people debate about this and it does not go the way one of them hopes then it is pointed out that of course all Otherkin may be nuts so what does it matter what is thought.

Do any of you feel nuts? Do any of you care what the people who call you nuts really think?
Maybe it's time you honestly held your hands up and said the human thing is given on the outside, and the nuts thing is entirely possible, but until proof comes forward I am going to go with what I believe and hang the rest. Have the courage of your convictions people, and stop falling back on 'Of course we might all be barking mad so who cares who thinks what?'
If you're mad then you wouldn't consider that it was a possibility, as mad people don't know they are. Any well trained psychiatrist would tell you that just the fact that you are considering it as a possibility means you are completely sane.

Yes, but the point still stands. I mean, we all believe we are what we are. The point is that that belief is just that...a belief. It isn't the ultimate truth. We won't know for sure that our beliefs are truths until we die. Therefore, saying that therians (I'll use therians for an example) have the best knowledge on what happens to therian souls after death, etc. isn't exactly true.

No it's not exactly true, but then it's not exactly what I said either.
However since mixing the metaphors seems to be confusing I will spell it out then there is nothing further to misunderstand.

If I were going to ask someone about a certain Kin type. I would ask a member of that certain Kin type. Because although they may not be an expert on their Kin type, there is a very good chance that they would have more knowledge of how thier kin type worked than a person who was not a member of that kin type.
That is just plain good old fashioned common sense.

This is now passing into the second stage these discussions always take Kes.
We have moved into the 'proof when we die' part of the topic.

I do not believe I am what I say I am, I know I am what I say I am. I have seen myself. Others have seen me too, and described me perfectly without my help in any way. So I know.
I don't have to wait until I die, I am convinced that I know now.

There is now only one place left for this conversation to go and that is the 'It doesn't matter what you believe I know what you are better than you do' part.
This is where someone posts to say something like "well I can't stop you thinking whatever you want but I know you're really human, and even if you don't want to admit it that won't change the fact that really you're just human."
It's what they always say.
You will find if you spend any time around forums that for those who do not think like I do there are three things they always say:
1. Well we may all be crazy so what does it matter what anyone thinks.
This generally translates as I am not winning this arguement.
2. Well for all of us it's just a belief and we won't find out the truth until we die.
This generally translates as I am not winning this arguement.
3. Well we're all human anyway and no amtter how much you want to deny it it's still the truth. It's a fact. you're human.
This generally translates as I am not winning this arguement and they won't shut up and just agree with me.
It's like a mantra, and it's very sad.
It's designed to give us no where to go. The only response is for us to give in and say 'oh yes of course you're right'.

It makes me very angry because they assume so much without really knowing what they're talking about. Because they're talking about me, and they don't know me.

Hands up who on this forum knows who and what they are is not a human being.

I've posted this thought on other forums and been asked to either say I am really human, leave, or I've just been banned for it with no discussion.
Because of that I'm not keen to say it again, but I'll hold my hand up and say me.
I know I'm a Dragon inside. I've seen and heard too much for too long to be unsure of myself at this point.

Can I ask if you don't think of yourself as human how do you explain what you look like, because that's the bit that always gets me into trouble when I try to explain it.

first the original topic: i believe that death is a strange experience. something like sleep, something like letting go, something like being ripped away. my belief is it is in the consciousness of our forms mortality along with our sense of self that dictates the exit of our soul. Sadly many non-kin reject death strongly. in rejecting it the death is even harsher the soul separates in a scattered pattern as it holds to its form instead of just itself. when one holds onto its self it releases its form in a more solid shape. the after world is a collection of energy there's a cleansing, an alignment of the soul, but if you're missing some pieces it's difficult and not as purifying, but in the end the soul converges as one again and if it has the presence of mind it can be reborn, some are forced into being reborn, some stay in the world between either by choice or by confusion. some choose their bodies, others gave up that choice by past actions. I believe this is the same for both kin and non-kin since i do not believe there is a very big difference between the two. There is a difference, a very defining one, but not enough to make us completely different things.

and i am kin. i have difficulty defining what I look like. usually if someone asks i just give them my original belief, the strongest bit of me, my panther image. but for the most part i don't tell them what i look like because i can't find a shape. It's a feeling. The same feeling I got when i first started my awakening, a difference that couldn't be ignored, a knowledge that others couldn't grasp. so i began to discover and i continue to do so. i may just be wrong to assume this, but i think others started this way too? that it was a feeling, an inner belief that led to awakening and so becoming.

My hand is up Fallen Kin. I have seen myself, I just don't know what I am. I know that whatever it was it wasn't human though.

I don't understand how Kin and Non-Kin can be the same.
I mean, I read and understood the words, but if there is no difference between the two then what makes some Kin and others not?
If you believe they are the same Katie, then how do you describe what you are and what makes you not Non-Kin?

To me, the soul makes the distinction when compared to the physical body. Otherkin are non-human souls in human bodies, while non-kin are human souls in human bodies. There's no difference, to me, other than just that. To me, a human soul has the ability to reincarnate, etc. just as, say, the soul of an elf.

Wow it must be quite difficult for you here then, thinking as you do.
This forum isn't really for people who don't connect firstly to their Kin is it?

If you think of yourself as human then you must feel really out of place here sometimes Byakko.

I was pretty sure this forum is for otherkin who don't force their beliefs on others...a safe haven as it were. I often feel in the minority with my beliefs here, but not out of place. Out of place insinuates that I shouldn't be here.